Central Lutheran Church - Elk River
Central Lutheran Church - Elk River
Philosophy Meets Science: A Journey to the Cosmic Edge {Reflections}
Unlock the secrets of the universe with our exploration of the cosmological argument for the existence of God. Ever wondered if the universe had a beginning and what that implies? Join us as we promise an enlightening journey through philosophical and scientific reasoning, where we discuss everything from the second law of thermodynamics to the pioneering work of Edwin Hubble. We investigate the idea that everything that begins must have a cause and how the universe itself points to a cause beyond time and space. Through this captivating conversation, we'll unravel complex theories and take you to the edge of the cosmic beginning, challenging your perceptions of existence.
In a compelling discussion, we ponder what it means to believe in a cause that exists outside the tangible limits of time and space. This episode questions the conventional narrative and offers a reasoned perspective on believing in a divine creator. While we acknowledge that this does not validate any particular religious tradition, it strongly supports the idea of a spaceless, timeless, and powerful cause—aligning with what many understand as God. Whether you're a skeptic or a believer, you're invited to join us at Central in Elk River for more intriguing discussions, as we continue to explore the mysteries of existence both online and in person.
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what is up everybody? Hey, welcome to our reflections podcast. My name is ryan. I'm in the studio with our producer, mike lauer. What's up? Mike Lauer is wearing a Buffalo Bills sweatshirt today. I had to give him well. Actually, they're playing well. Minus this most recent game, they've been playing well, but my Broncos are coming off a two-game winning streak, so I'm riding high.
Speaker 1:A couple of podcasts ago, we were talking about how to talk about the faith with folks who maybe don't believe in God, or how to argue for the existence of God with people who don't believe in God, and these kind of things, and I casually mentioned several different arguments for God. We call these classical arguments, and I thought it'd be cool to actually do one podcast on each, maybe just pick a small handful of them and unpack it and explain it a bit. And so Mike liked that idea as well, so we're going to do it. So today, the argument, this classical argument for the existence of God, is called the cosmological argument, and here's what it is. It's trying to answer the question does God exist? Is it reasonable to believe that there is a God who is a creator and exists before all things? So does God exist, or is the material world, all that there is, that ever was and ever will be. And so here's the argument.
Speaker 1:It's two premises, with the conclut premises. Premises Two premise there's one premise and there's a second premise. Then there's a conclusion. Here's the first premise. The premise is whatever begins to exist has to have a cause. Premise two the universe begins to exist. The conclusion is therefore then the universe has a cause. So whatever begins to exist has a cause. The universe began to exist. Therefore the universe must have a cause outside of itself, it didn't always just exist. So premise one is it true? Well, you and I don't see things in the natural world just sort of come into being from nothing, except for, I don't know, a magician pulling a rabbit out of a hat or the Vikings suddenly being 4-0, just out of nowhere. They're winning. That's a joke, I love the Vikings. Just out of nowhere they're winning. That's a joke, I love the Vikings.
Speaker 1:But most of the, actually all of our experiences, our everyday experiences, suggest that things don't just come into being, and there's scientific evidence also that confirms that things that come into being must have a cause. If something exists or begins to exist, it must have a cause. The egg came from the chicken. That chicken came from an egg. Now we can argue about what came first, but the point is that everything that exists, according to our own experiences and even science, everything that exists came from something. So premise one is true.
Speaker 1:Premise two is it true? Premise two was that the universe began to exist. Well, did it? Did the universe begin? Did it have a beginning or has it always existed?
Speaker 1:Many atheists suggest that the universe began to exist. Well, did it? Did the universe begin? Did it have a beginning or has it always existed? Many atheists suggest that the universe has just always existed. Bertrand Russell, for example, the great Bertrand Russell, great thinker, says the universe is just there and that's all. And so many folks suggest that the universe had no beginning, it just has always existed. However, the second law of thermodynamics and you can Google that and go down a rabbit hole there too, but the second law of thermodynamics tells us that the universe is slowly running out of usable energy. There's a finite amount of usable energy and we're running out of it. So if the universe had always been and has always been, it would have long ago run out of that usable energy by now. And so the second law kind of tells us the universe seems to have a definite beginning.
Speaker 1:Then Einstein comes along and develops what he calls his theory of relativity, which allows us to begin to talk meaningfully about the history of the universe. There was a history, there's a past start and like a middle, and then where we are now. And then also him, and then a guy called Alexander Friedman, a guy called Georges Lemaitre he's a French guy these two guys who begin to use Einstein's equations. They begin to talk about and explore the universe as expanding, that it's slowly moving away from itself and ever expanding. It's sort of getting larger, and so there's like a definite beginning and it's boom, it's expanding from then and it's going away from itself all the time. Then a guy called edwin hubble, in 1929 he began to measure the red shift in light from these distant galaxies and he confirms that, this idea that the universe is indeed expanding, and he also confirms that it came into being from a single, definitive point in our, in our, in our finite past. This was a huge discovery by Edwin Hubble that the universe not only is it expanding, but it came into being from a definite point. There was a starting point of the universe itself, and so the time-space universe is expanding from a single point in the finite past and all matter, all energy, all, all space, all time sort of comes into being at this initial cosmological singularity. There is definitely a beginning to this universe.
Speaker 1:Now many scientists and sort of argue with these guys try to create other alternative models, and you can look at those, you can google all those as well, but they all, over time, begin to be debunked and they start to fail. So the universe, it does seem to have a definitive beginning, and this even applies to the multiverse, if you know what the multiverse is, or the multiverse theory. Even that theory, there still has to be a beginning point from which the multiverse has come out of. And so scientists have to wrestle with this idea of a cosmic beginning. And any model for the cosmos and the universe existing, it must have in its model a beginning.
Speaker 1:Okay, so premise one whatever begins to exist has a cause. That's true, we would all agree. Premise two the universe began to exist and had a beginning. It didn't always just exist, it had a beginning. So that's, it didn't always just exist, it had a beginning. So that's also true. So premise one is true. Premise two is true. Therefore the conclusion must be true and the conclusion is of course, there is a cause to the universe.
Speaker 1:Now, the universe itself has a cause. It cannot come into being itself. So the cause, whatever causes the universe to exist and the cosmos to exist, it must be beyond the time and space universe itself. So, whatever the causes must be spaceless, it must be timeless, it must be immaterial. It cannot be a created thing, it must be uncaused, because all these other things are causes. There must be a cause that caused all of them, that is itself uncaused and it must be, by definition, unimaginatively powerful. So, spaceless, timeless, immaterial, uncaused, no beginning, unimaginatively powerful, this is what we call God.
Speaker 1:So, according to the cosmological argument, it is totally reasonable to believe in an uncaused cause, in God, this timeless, spaceless, immaterial, uncaused thing that's powerful, that was the catalyst, the cause for all other things that came into being. It's not unreasonable to believe in God. Now here's the one caveat. This doesn't necessarily prove the Judeo-Christian story or that the Bible is true, or that Jesus rose from the dead. It's just suggesting that it is reasonable to believe in God and that's okay. So, hey, bless you guys, peace, we'll catch you around. Bless you guys, Peace, we'll catch you around. Hey, if you enjoy this show, I'd love to have you share it with some friends. And don't forget, you are always welcome to join us in person at Central in Elk River at 830, which is our liturgical gathering, or at 10 o'clock, our modern gathering, or you can check us out online at clcelkriverorg Peace.
