#143 - Why There's No Flag in the Sanctuary {Reflections Re-Release}

The question sounds simple until you sit with it: why would a church choose not to hang an American flag in the sanctuary? With Independence Day nearby, we revisit a conversation that gets honest about gratitude for country while also drawing a bright line around worship, identity, and what we place at the center of our faith. 

We talk about loving where you’re from, honoring service, and still refusing to let any national symbol outrank the cross of Christ. That means naming the difference between patriotism and nationalism, and admitting that national values can sometimes drift into direct conflict with the teachings of Jesus. When that happens, our allegiance has to be clear: we are first “in Christ,” citizens of the kingdom of God, shaped by the way of Jesus. 

A powerful moment comes from veteran funerals. The military’s care and honor is beautiful, and the flag matters. But when a casket enters the sanctuary, many churches replace the flag with a white funeral pall marked by a cross, not as a slight to the nation, but as a reminder that we gather under one shared identity and one shared hope. We also explore the Bible’s insistence on blessing the foreigner and loving the outsider, and what that means for churches that worship alongside people from many nations. 

If this helped you think more clearly about Christian identity, Christian nationalism, and what belongs in a worship space, subscribe, share this with a friend, and leave a review. What symbols do you think should define a church sanctuary?

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Transcript

Why We’re Replaying This Talk

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Hey everyone, Olivia here. As you probably know, Pastor Ryan is on sabbatical this summer. So until he gets back, I will be re-releasing some of the most listened to episodes from the Reflections podcast. Today's episode originally aired in December of 2023. With Independence Day coming up this week, I thought this would be a fitting episode to revisit. Enjoy.

The Sanctuary Flag Question

SPEAKER_00 0:44

What is up, everyone? Ryan here, and I am joining you in Mike's Beats Laboratory, aka our podcasting office. And we're here for our weekly podcast. We call it Reflections. And the question I want to ask or try to talk about today, I was asked this question a couple months ago, and somebody asked me this. They said, Hey, why doesn't Central, which is our church here in Elk River, uh, the greatest city in all of Minnesota and the world, I would argue, why don't we have a flag, an American flag in the sanctuary? And it's a fair question because for two reasons. One, at Central, many years ago, before I got here, they used to have a flag in the sanctuary, an American flag up front, along with a Christian flag or what's known as the Christian flag. And then two, there's many churches around the country anyway that have an American flag up front, or even out in the front of the building, like out in a on a flagpole. And so I yeah, I wanted to answer, because we we actually have a um a we do have a reason why we don't have one in the sanctuary, and it's one that I stand by and I wanted to kind of explain it or unpack it. And first I'll say this look, I I love this country. I I think that all of us should love where we came from and where we're from and be proud of that. And I I am, and you know, maybe you know, I grew up in Denver, Colorado, and I love Denver. And actually, now though, I consider Minnesota home, and I love Minnesota. I love Elk River. I'm very proud of that. I love to brag about Elk River. I've raised my kids here, it's home for them. I love so many things about this city and about the great state of Minnesota, and I love this country. I've traveled all around the world, I've been to every continent except for Antarctica, and I love it here in the United States. I wouldn't want to live anywhere else. And so I hear me when I say it's good to love where you're from, to be proud of that, to talk about it with some, you know, with some with some fondness, and I I love that. But I would say this my identity is not first and foremost a citizen of Elk River or of the great state of Minnesota or of this country of the United States. My primary identity, at least according to the Bible, is that I am in Christ. I am a beloved son of God, and I am a citizen, as Paul writes, of a different kingdom. That's the kingdom of God. And so I always want to make sure I have the just the order correct. That my primary identity is as a son of God, and I'm a citizen of the kingdom of God. Because here's the deal. Sometimes our national values or the things that we value as a nation, or the values of the state, or the values of the city, even, sometimes those things, those values, in ways that are obvious or in ways that are very subtle, those values can come into direct conflict with the values of Jesus and the teachings of Jesus. And so if ever those things ever come into conflict, my I have to remember that my primary identity, the pathway I'm following, my uh my rabbi is Jesus and not anything else, not the ideologies of the city, of the state, of the of the nation. And so I always want to make sure that I have things in proper order because sometimes they do conflict with each other.

Patriotism Versus Nationalism

SPEAKER_00 4:00

And so for if you look at Israel's history, Israel, one of their great sins, way back, you know, uh when they're given the Mosaic Law, one of their great sins was this sin of nationalism. Now, nationalism is not the same thing as patriotism. Nationalism tends to be this idea when you begin to elevate yourself, your own identity over and against other people or outsiders. And Israel did this on many occasions. They were commanded by God on several uh instances to take care of foreigners and outsiders and include them in the blessings of God. And they didn't do that, they valued their own national identity on many occasions over and against their neighbor. So, for example, in the Mosaic law in Leviticus 23, 22, this is one of my favorite verses. God says, Hey, when you reap the harvest of your land, like when you're out there harvesting your crop, you shall not reap to the very edges of your field or gather the gleanings of your harvest. You shall leave them for the poor and for the alien or the foreigner. I am the Lord your God. In other words, he tells the people of Israel, When you're plowing your fields, when you're reaping the harvest, leave the edges. Don't gather those fruits, those crops, those whatever it was that you're gathering. Leave them for the poor and the outsider, the foreigner, uh, the widows, and let them be included in the blessing of God. I've blessed you, now you go bless others. And nationalism is sort of counter to that. It's not sharing what extra you have with the foreigner, the neighbor, the outsider. It's rather just like enclosing, you know, the circle and only uh looking after your own. And so this idea of nationalism is again, it's it's not patriotic. That's different. Patriotism is fine in most cases, but when it rises where it's over and against the neighbor, over and against the outsider, where we don't include others in the blessings of God, that becomes a problem. When we elevate our identity as Americans, as Minnesotans, or even as Elk Riverens over and against our identity as Jesus followers, that's a

Veterans Funerals And The Funeral Pall

SPEAKER_00 6:05

problem. And so one of my favorite things that I love doing here at Central is it sounds macabre, but it's I love doing funerals. And I love doing funerals for veterans. I mean, the way that the military shows honor to these ones who have served this country is just beautiful. They do it, they do it like second to nobody. It's it's outstanding. I've done a number of funerals for service members, and it's just really a way to respect and honor those who have served this country, and I love it. And one of the things they'll do is they'll put an American flag over top of the casket. Another just beautiful way to honor the one who's died. But here's what we do, and we aren't the only church that does this, but many times in churches, when we wheel the casket into the sanctuary, we take the American flag off and we put over top of the casket, it's called a funeral paw. It's a white, a beautiful piece of cloth that covers the whole casket and it's got a cross on it, and then we wheel the casket in from there. And they they fold up the flag and they take care of it, they put it on a shelf just during the service. And the reason is because when when that casket goes in there, we want people to remember that our primary identity as Christians is that we are people of the cross, not the flag. And so uh so when we go into the sanctuary, the space of this place of worshiping God, we remind each other that we are, and the the Paul is white, by the way, which is a beautiful symbol of who we are in Christ. We've been washed, you know, the sins that were as red as scarlet are now as white as snow. There's that beautiful imagery. And also it's got a cross, so we all gather under the cross. We are all on equal footing here because we're people of the cross. Then we kind of come back out of the sanctuary and we go to the grave site, we put the flag back on it. Uh, not because we're not in favor of the flag or this country. It's totally different. It's just that when we gather in there, we want to gather, reminding ourselves of our primary identity as the people of God, as one blind beggar helping another blind beggar find food. And also recognizing that when we gather in there, there's lots of folks who gather who are not Americans. We actually have some people at Central who worship with us who are uh who are uh from Tanzania. We have others from other African nations. And when we gather for worship, we want to remind folks that our primary identity is the cross, which is like the main symbol in our sanctuary. So

Loving Neighbors Without Losing Identity

SPEAKER_00 8:17

love where you're from and love your city and be proud of it. And it's hey, it's they all have warts. That's okay. Warts and all, I love Elk River. And Minnesota, same thing, or wherever you're from. And it's okay to kind of you know be proud of that and rep your city, rep your state, rep where you're from. In the United States, I mean, I love cheering for the U.S. and the World Cup. I'm all in on the World Cup and the American team of America. I love it. But if it's ever over and against the neighbor, our Mexican neighbors to the south, our Canadian neighbors to the north, or anywhere else globally, that's a problem. Jesus said he commands us to love our neighbors, to make disciples of all nations. And then, of course, in this Jewish tradition, to love and bless the foreigner. And how can we do that as people of God? There's all kinds of ways, but we can never elevate our identity as a citizen of this world over and against our identity as kingdom people of God, which looks our citizenship always looks like Jesus dying on the cross. That's the kingdom of God. So love where you're from and also be a person of the cross wherever you go. All right, love you guys. I'll catch you soon. Peace. Hey, if you enjoy this show, I'd love to have you share it with some friends. And don't forget, you are always welcome to join us in person at Central in Elk River at 8 30, which is our liturgical gathering, or at 10 o'clock, our modern gathering. Or you can check us out online at clcelkriver.org. Peace.